Powering Philips XX1080

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marc13
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Joined: 21 Apr 2018, 20:00
Location: Zurich

Powering Philips XX1080

Post by marc13 » 22 Apr 2018, 16:45

Hi there :wave:

I have recently bought two philips XX1080 image intensifier tubes and I cant find a way to power them.
The voltage required is 14kv DC, and I'd like to power them with batteries(3-18v DC).
The only thing I have found thus far is this schematichttp://www.jogis-roehrenbude.de/Roehren ... xx1080.pdf.
I don't know enough about electronics to make sense of the schematic in the pdf or find another way, so I'd appreciate any advice.

Thanks in advance for your advice.
Yours,
marc13

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hairyyoda
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Location: Carmarthenshire

Re: Powering Philips XX1080

Post by hairyyoda » 22 Apr 2018, 18:31

Marc13.
The Philips company is now re-named under the Photonis group, fire off a few email to Photonis tell them what you are trying to do, and explain that your are studying the night sky etc.
I have some tubes and power units somewhere :?: not sure if I have any printed information, bare with me :!:

Thanks
Phil
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Lambda
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Joined: 31 Oct 2017, 17:41
Location: Den Haag, NL

Re: Powering Philips XX1080

Post by Lambda » 22 Apr 2018, 18:40

High Marc13,
The DC supply described in the pdf document is based on the following principle:
- there is an AC voltage( ideally sinuosidal ) which is generated by an oscillator (left bloc comprising two transistors in fig. 1, or transistor/ic block in fig. 2). The oscillator being fed by a dc battery of few volts.
Then
- said AC voltage is applied to a first transformer which will feed a structure made of a net of diodes/capacités called voltage multiplier. Said structure will multiply the efficient voltage delivered by the transformer, stage after stage, in cascade manner, but also it will rectify this voltage for providing at the output of the last stage, the high dc voltage required.

One type, which corresponds to the diodes/capacitors net illustrated in fig. 1 is called Villard multiplier, but there is plenty of variantes possible.

https://www.electronics-tutorials.ws/bl ... rcuit.html

So one possibility is to do a homemade version by following strictly and with discipline a proper reliability-proofed schéma coming from a database or a technical article, guideline... there is not a lot of current generated, few ma roughly, but several kv between the terminal electrodes of the multiplier. So to be cautious is mandatory, and if you are not in electronics, perhaps asking to someone having skills in this domain...

Another possibility would be to use ready made dc-dc up converter like that.

dc-dc converter step up 15 kv https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_odkw=d ... V&_sacat=0

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_odkw=d ... V&_sacat=0

It has to be regularly monitored for finding the good model in E-Bay, for instance...

And to adapt connect your tube to such module... but honestly, I am not convinced by the reliability on long term of these cheap modules... high voltage in presence, to be cautious...(see above)

An other possibility would be to order to Abex company a dc power supply designed to be used with the xx1080.

https://www.abex.co.uk/esales/optical/p ... /index.php

See the HT PSU cylinder on the right of the binocular assembly... I do not know if they sell the HT PSU alone or if you would have to buy the whole binocular system.... it has to be asked to them...

For the DIY alternatives, be aware that you would also need a second focusing voltage, and not only the main HT voltage applied between the photocathode and the anode/screen phosphore. This second focusing voltage is around 450V. The HT PSU (Abex) is complete, in this sense.

Therefore, the total dc supply which would be fed by your battery (3-18 V DC, up to you...), but it would have to include two voltage outputs (14 kV applied between the photocathode (-) and the anode (+)) and a second output voltage of 450 V applied between the focusing électrode and the photocathode or the anode/screen. Said point has to be checked with the datasheet of the tube or perhaps deducted from observing the general diagram wiring of the kind of tube made during the same period...

Here more infos about the wiring...

http://lampes-et-tubes.info/ic/ic013.php?l=e

Big chance that the 450 V would have to be applied between the photocathode (being the potential reference of the system) and the focusing electrode (+), but as suggested by Phil, a mail to photonis would bring you the informations you need...

Just some ideas brought here... good luck and keep us inform about your project! :thumbup:

Regards,

Lambda

marc13
Posts: 4
Joined: 21 Apr 2018, 20:00
Location: Zurich

Re: Powering Philips XX1080

Post by marc13 » 24 Apr 2018, 18:21

Thank you very much for your quick replies.
@Lambda
I'll probably try finding a dc-dc step up converter to 14kv first to see if the tubes even work(I'll give the local electronics stores another good look).
The focusing voltage shouldn't really be a problem, converters for 500v aren't that hard to get.
As for ordering the PSU from Abex, I have read that they replied to people wanting to buy the psu only that they only sell the whole binoculars, and even if they have changed their mind, the shipping cost from the uk alone would be more expensive then the tubes :crazy: ...
@hairyyoda
I might try contacting photonis, but as I already know the operating&focus voltages, they can't provide any real help(that is, if thy don't sell the appropriate psu...).

Thanks again for your advice, I'll keep you updated on any progress I make.

Kind regards,

Marc13

Edit:
I have found this(https://www.ebay.de/itm/DC-3V-to-7KV-70 ... SwofxUg0~C) on ebay. Is this something else or yould two of these in series suffice to power the tube?
Last edited by marc13 on 24 Apr 2018, 19:29, edited 1 time in total.

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hairyyoda
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Location: Carmarthenshire

Re: Powering Philips XX1080

Post by hairyyoda » 24 Apr 2018, 18:30

Marc13.

I have bought 14K Power Supply Units off Ebay.de a few years ago for not a lot of Euros O/K

Thanks
Phil
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marc13
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Joined: 21 Apr 2018, 20:00
Location: Zurich

Re: Powering Philips XX1080

Post by marc13 » 24 Apr 2018, 19:33

Hairyyoda

Ok then I'll wait 'til I find a 14kv power supply on ebay.

Thanks
Marc13

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hairyyoda
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Location: Carmarthenshire

Re: Powering Philips XX1080

Post by hairyyoda » 24 Apr 2018, 20:21

Marc13.

I have found 5 of these AEG 12K Power Units, think they are for the Hensoldt Fero type of Gen 2 + binoculars :?: the binocular eye piece model which has a single objective lens, :think: I will check

Image

Thanks
Phil
ImageImage

marc13
Posts: 4
Joined: 21 Apr 2018, 20:00
Location: Zurich

Re: Powering Philips XX1080

Post by marc13 » 25 Apr 2018, 16:19

Hairyyoda,
Thanks for your answer.
Unfortunately, I don't think 12kv will be enough to power it, but I don't know how much you can over-/underpower it with it working(and, preferrably, without frying the elctronics ;) )

I think I'll try to get parts for a high voltage cascade so I can be sure it won't fry the tube.

kind regards,
Marc13

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